Det viser seg at Speidel har klart å gjøre en farlig feil ved kobling av jording på Speidel 50l med ny kontroller. De har jordet en pumpe og et varmeelement. Dette kan i verste tilfelle medføre fare hvis man skrur løs pumpen uten jording, og denne skulle ha jordfeil, mens strømmen er tilkoblet. Sendte epost til Ralf hos Speidel og forklarte faren.
I checked my contoller tonight regarding ground of pumps. Just one of the pumps where connected to ground and one of the heating elements. On my old controller (grey) both pumps are connected to ground and none of the elements. So I opened it and found out this (Pic 1.)
I rewired it and made it like this. Pic 2
Groundwire to the heatingelement are pointless because they have no ground.
If this is normal I would strongly suggest that you start grounding both pumps. It can be lethal if there should be a groundfault to to the pump without ground and one unscrew it without disconnecting the power. With Regards Espen
Svar 1:
Hello Espen,
thank you for making us aware of this issue.
From our basics the wiring in picture 1 is right.
The guy who made the wire diagram is o Holiday this week and will be back next week.
So I will ask him a bit more detailed about this issue and let you know.
Best regards
Ralf Leukart
Sendte purring på svar:
Hello Espen,
yes I got an answer form the guy who was designing the controller this morning.
And he confirmed that you are right in basic.
So thank you very much for this important hint.
You are right that the connection from the heating element to the ground wiring
is pointless.
From the view of safety I would say it will not come to accidents as the issue that
one has a ground fault at the pump and has dismantled the pump from the housing
at the same time is very, very seldom.
From law I can say that it is generally not allowed to connect electrical devices to
the power net during they are disassembled. Referring to the European EU standards.
Guess the Norwegian law will say the same?
Also we give the hint in our manual two times on topics 2.1 and 2.2 that the unit has
to be disconnected from the power net for any other operations as brewing
But anyway we will change the wiring as you suggested to protect our customer no
matter if it has to be done or not and give the customer the most safety we can.
So I want to thank you once more for your help to improve our Braumeister.
Best regards
Ralf Leukart
Svar fra teknikker:
Guten Morgen Herr Leukart,
Bei IT230V müssen elektrisch leitende Gehäuseteile mit Ground verbunden sein und auch die Pumpen sollten geerdet sein. Insofern hat Espen recht, dass Ground aller Pumpen angeschlossen sein sollten. Nur ganz so dramatisch, wie er es darstellt, ist es aus meiner Sicht nicht: die Pumpen sind mit Ihrem Gehäuse elektrisch mit dem Kessel verbunden und der Kessel ist zusätzlich auch noch mit Ground verbunden.
Es ist also zu empfehlen Ground beider Pumpen anzuschließen und dies sollte in der Fertigung umgesetzt werden.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
E. Kaspereit
Svaret fra teknikker er i hovedsak at det ikke er noen fare i og med at pumpa er jordet så lenge den er skrudd fast til kjelen, men poenget mitt har fra begynnelsen hvert at ved separering av pumpe ved vask kan fare oppstå. Murphys lov: Det som kan gå galt vil før eller siden gå galt.
Min anbefaling: Skru opp kontroller og koble til jord.
I checked my contoller tonight regarding ground of pumps. Just one of the pumps where connected to ground and one of the heating elements. On my old controller (grey) both pumps are connected to ground and none of the elements. So I opened it and found out this (Pic 1.)
I rewired it and made it like this. Pic 2
Groundwire to the heatingelement are pointless because they have no ground.
If this is normal I would strongly suggest that you start grounding both pumps. It can be lethal if there should be a groundfault to to the pump without ground and one unscrew it without disconnecting the power. With Regards Espen
Svar 1:
Hello Espen,
thank you for making us aware of this issue.
From our basics the wiring in picture 1 is right.
The guy who made the wire diagram is o Holiday this week and will be back next week.
So I will ask him a bit more detailed about this issue and let you know.
Best regards
Ralf Leukart
Sendte purring på svar:
Hello Espen,
yes I got an answer form the guy who was designing the controller this morning.
And he confirmed that you are right in basic.
So thank you very much for this important hint.
You are right that the connection from the heating element to the ground wiring
is pointless.
From the view of safety I would say it will not come to accidents as the issue that
one has a ground fault at the pump and has dismantled the pump from the housing
at the same time is very, very seldom.
From law I can say that it is generally not allowed to connect electrical devices to
the power net during they are disassembled. Referring to the European EU standards.
Guess the Norwegian law will say the same?
Also we give the hint in our manual two times on topics 2.1 and 2.2 that the unit has
to be disconnected from the power net for any other operations as brewing
But anyway we will change the wiring as you suggested to protect our customer no
matter if it has to be done or not and give the customer the most safety we can.
So I want to thank you once more for your help to improve our Braumeister.
Best regards
Ralf Leukart
Svar fra teknikker:
Guten Morgen Herr Leukart,
Bei IT230V müssen elektrisch leitende Gehäuseteile mit Ground verbunden sein und auch die Pumpen sollten geerdet sein. Insofern hat Espen recht, dass Ground aller Pumpen angeschlossen sein sollten. Nur ganz so dramatisch, wie er es darstellt, ist es aus meiner Sicht nicht: die Pumpen sind mit Ihrem Gehäuse elektrisch mit dem Kessel verbunden und der Kessel ist zusätzlich auch noch mit Ground verbunden.
Es ist also zu empfehlen Ground beider Pumpen anzuschließen und dies sollte in der Fertigung umgesetzt werden.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
E. Kaspereit
Svaret fra teknikker er i hovedsak at det ikke er noen fare i og med at pumpa er jordet så lenge den er skrudd fast til kjelen, men poenget mitt har fra begynnelsen hvert at ved separering av pumpe ved vask kan fare oppstå. Murphys lov: Det som kan gå galt vil før eller siden gå galt.
Min anbefaling: Skru opp kontroller og koble til jord.
